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u/ZengaStromboli
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4d ago
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Can a former skinhead reach salvation?
Just give it to me straight.
I used to be one. Racist, sexist, homophobic, the works. I was a fucking shithead. So was my father, and his father before him. All that "southern pride" bullshit.
But I changed. At least, I like to think I did. I abandoned my ways, realized I had been brainwashed, went hard left, pulled a fucking my name is earl with the people I hurt, donate to good causes, hell, even fucking protest.
But, well, yet, I still feel like I can never redeem myself. I can never put more positive out that I did negative. I have trouble getting out of bed, or doing anything for myself, after realizing just how bad of a fuckup I was.
It's been.. Years. Almost a decade. But.
Can I be redeemed? Can I ever become a "good" person?
Edit: Thank you so much for your kind words, it really means a lot. Unfortunately, I can't respond to every post, but I can say this.
Please, for the love of god, stop arguing about religion. Just be good to one another, okay?
Edit 2: I.. Didn't realize when I said skinhead, people would.. Think I was a skinhead! As in, a literal skinhead. Shaved head, tattoos, sloppy steaks, the works.
Which is admittedly very stupid of me. I'm sorry for betraying your trust.
To note, I never joined a group or anything. Never got the tattoos either. I do want to say, that, well, I was probably on the edge of it, though, unfortunately. I was a real mean, hateful, virulent son of a bitch. Gun without a cause, you know? Keg without a fuse, or.. Like. Keg with a fuse?
Either way, it's. Well. I thankfully never did join a group, but the beliefs, the actions, the words, it all unfortunately fell in line with it.
I guess I'm just glad I was never filled with enough hatred to physically hurt someone.
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u/hurshy238
4d ago
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Do you understand the amount of hope it can give to other people to see that a racist, sexist, homophobic shithead CAN CHANGE? that's a shitload of positivity to give us right there.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
I hadn't thought about it like that.. Now, if only my father could.
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u/221B_BakerSt_ 4d ago edited 4d ago •
For background, I'm a queer Jewish female therapist. Everything about your journey made my night! You affirmed that the groups who hate me and those marginalized like me are made up of real individuals, all with the ability to grow into love and reject hate. Your determination and success turning one heart away from hatred - even if it's your own - has created infinite ripples of positivity into the universe.
Own and be proud of your growth! Show yourself kindness and compassion, because you are a human being and deserve it.
Ps. I also suggest seeking therapy to help you along your journey. If you need help finding resources DM me.
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u/funkylittledeathomen 4d ago •
I saw something once that really resonated with me, couldn’t tell you where I saw it but someone said their college professor said something like, “a lot of you are here because you want to save the world. I’m here to tell you that it’s okay if you only save one person, and it’s okay if that person is you.”
OP, you’re doing great. Keep walking the walk, and be proud of yourself. Many people are terrible at showing themselves grace and being able to admit they made mistakes. Good on you for realizing the error in your views and growing as a person
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u/BeBraveShortStuff 4d ago
My college professor said something exactly like that at the conclusion of her class. It was extremely difficult subject matter and a lot of us were struggling with the idea that we wanted to save everyone, but you can’t. It’s just not possible. I think she saw how distraught we were and she said even if the change was just us, that was enough.
I had forgotten about that. Thank you for the reminder.
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u/rl_cookie 4d ago
Very much along the lines of “I wanted to change the world, but I have found that the only thing one can be sure of is changing oneself” from Aldous Huxley, author of Brave New World.
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u/Mydriaseyes 4d ago
sometimes, just one positive interaction with an individual can, unbeknownst to you, save a life. butterfly effect style :)
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u/bitsmythe 4d ago
I heard a similar phrase the other day, "you can't hug every cat"
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u/221B_BakerSt_ 4d ago
What a beautiful sentiment! I'm going to keep in mind for my clients who always feel like they have to do something big to give their lives' meaning. They need to recognize that just being kind to themselves is enough sometimes.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
Thank you. I.. Honestly had friends in it too, who I tried to help, but. Well, I was too deep into it myself to really be able to pull anyone else out. Now that I'm out, I honestly don't even know where they are. It's like hate was the one binding thread.
I'm in therapy, for. Well, everything. I hope this info helps in some way.
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u/221B_BakerSt_ 4d ago
It's good to hear you're getting help. It sounds like you're carrying a lot of moral injury that needs to be processed.
Hate and anger are addictive emotions. They give us a sense of security of our place in the world. And just like with other addictions, it's common that relationships don't survive once one person has broken the habit and the other is still deep in it. Your friends saw you question and break away. That may have planted the seed to let them know that different choices were possible.
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u/FiainTheCorgi 4d ago
I'm proud of you.
When we grow up in situations like that, it's difficult to change - and many never do. And yet, you looked at yourself. You made the effort to change. You're in therapy to help yourself!
That in itself, is inspiring. That itself, shows your heart. And I am proud of you.
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u/Tomnooksmainhoe 4d ago
Agreed, sibling! ❤️ It gives me some hope when it feels like we don’t have a lot right now. Also, thank you for being a therapist and thank you for telling OP that they can reach out too if they have therapy questions. I am proud of OP, and hope for the best on their journey.
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u/221B_BakerSt_ 4d ago
Thank you for the love! And for appreciating my profession! I feel so honored and humbled that I get to be do it and am glad to help others however I can.
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u/EverybodyShitsNFT 4d ago
I’m looking forward to finding out how this friendship grows when Netflix releases a 6 part indie style drama about it.
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u/mintman72 4d ago
Never in my wildest imagination would I have thought I'd see a queer Jewish female SINCERELY offer to help a racist, sexist, homophobic, fucking shithead of a skinhead find resources to help them get the therapy they so sweetly deserve!
Yet more ripples of positivity...
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u/cubistninja 4d ago
former racist, sexist, homophobic fucking shithead of a skinhead.
The former part is the most important part
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u/mintman72 4d ago
Shit, I forgot to copy "former"! Thank you for the correction! It most certainly is a huge distinction!
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u/221B_BakerSt_ 4d ago
Well, OP wasn't born any of those things and has worked hard to not be those things anymore. That is something I truly respect and admire. It's much more simple being a good person when you were always taught that way and had you basic needs met. There is a unique strength and resilience to those who reject the hate they were taught and embrace the ones they were meant to scorn.
If I can help OP or anyone find the resources or skills to help themselves share some of the love and compassion they've learned to give others, I'm all the more honored to be a small part of that journey.
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u/reebekilyllaeri 4d ago
There is a unique strength and resilience to those who reject the hate they were taught and embrace the ones they were meant to scorn.
True grit. There's also a hefty whack of emotional honesty.
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u/NoExtensionCords 4d ago
I'm a queer Jewish female therapist.
That seems like an incredibly niche market.
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u/silversmoosher 4d ago
Don’t worry much about your father. Think of the future. Your kids. Your nieces and nephews. All of the young people you come into contact with. Sadly. Fathers can be stuck where they are. But the next generation is not.
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u/DyzJuan_Ydiot 4d ago
How many skinheads could be encouraged by your (OP's) story to leave that shitshow behind?
Many, like OP, didn't seek or choose a bigoted path but were born into it and/or were surrounded by it and don't think about making a different choice without hearing it had been done by someone else.
Finding paths towards collective unity are our own to find. Whatever we find may inspire others.
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u/hurshy238 4d ago
wow, and look at the innovative use of superscript! i am inspired. like that has been a possibility and i have never thought to do it?!?! you totally rock!
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u/AldusPrime 4d ago
I totally agree with thr above commenter.
There is something really inspiring about knowing someone can be super terrible and make a 180 degree turn.
We live in a world that’s filled with so much racism and homophobia, it feels like things will never get better. You’re a ray of sunshine.
Also, I’d just add that it’s always inspiring when people turn their lives around. I’ve made huge mistakes (I mostly did damage to myself), and I turned my life around. In many ways, though, I’m still paying the cost of, and digging myself out of, those earlier mistakes. Sometimes it’s demoralizing.
So, any time I see someone who’s made big mistakes and turned it around, it gives me hope for myself also. Like, I’m not the only one who didn’t have a life that went from Full House to Friends and everything was hunky dory all the way. I want to hear about people who had to struggle, like I did, even if their struggle was different from mine. I want to hear about people who made huge mistakes, like I did, and were able to change course. I want to know that I’m not the only one.
So, I appreciate everything you’re up to, and that you shared about it on Reddit.
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u/ambientfruit 4d ago
Parents, especially older generation parents like boomers, are hard to change. You can only slap down hard on things you don't find acceptable in your presence anymore. Even if you don't change his thinking, if he respects you at all, you'll have some peace.
You're doing good dude! Keep on keeping on!
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u/MaximumZer0 4d ago
Your father might not, but you've already proven that you're better than him. Maybe someday you'll inspire him.
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u/swords_of_queen 4d ago
Yeah we all are wishing and hoping that someone who is caught up in that ideology could possibly be reasoned with. I don’t want to hurt or destroy such people, I just want to have a real conversation. It is very hard to actually change and I have a lot of respect for people who can!
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u/CivilRiceOnionRing 4d ago
As a black activist, same. I'm just happy to see someone change their path for the good. If we can't be forgiven for a past that was created due to our upbringing, what's the point on even changing.
The only time it bothers me when someone changes and does a 180 in their harmful beliefs is when they're like 90+ years old... because the amount of damage they have done last for atleast a couple generations and it's more self serving than growth.
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u/Cynner97
Will there be apple pie?
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edited 4d ago
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I believe anyone can be a "good" person. You just have to have the correct mentality and show actions to prove it. Let that be just being respectful and show shame when people are discriminating someome.
the only real thing thats stopping us is our pride. But for you to openly admit you were that type of person from generation to generation, yet wanna change is proof enough. I hope you keep putting aside your differences & continue to improve
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u/noxxit 4d ago
Past me is dead. I killed him and made sure he never can return to hurt anybody.
I feel like you need to walk the walk, but OP seems to be doing just that.
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u/DarkandDanker 4d ago
Ops already a good person in my eyes, better man than me, and I've never been racist, homophobic, whatever
But it sounds like dudes actively doing more than most
The past is the past, you doing good now, that's what really matters
Give yo self a break op
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u/Calm_Investment 4d ago
Hey. What this guy says on generations is important... Don't underestimate the power and control your parents had over your beliefs.
It is no mean feat overcoming familial influences.
And put down the stick. You are doing great.
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u/Kat-Sith
4d ago
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Good and evil are things that people do, not who they are.
And sure, there will be some folks who will never forgive you. That's just something you'll have to live with. But being a better person doesn't come from the approval of others, it comes from uplifting people and fighting against injustice.
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u/Cinemasaur 4d ago edited 4d ago
This is the advice someone very important to me once said and it's the one piece of advice that's stuck with me as being true.
People want to label or be labeled bad or good, but really, they're actions, and you cant erase actions, but you can try and put more good ones out there than you did bad.
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u/burnalicious111 4d ago
Depending on where you are in your life, you may not even be able to do more good than bad.
It's still worth doing whatever good you can.
There aren't some cosmic scales to be balanced that make it worth it to do good in the world. Why wouldn't it be worth it to do what you have the power to do in the time you have? More good is always good.
We can only strive to be better than we were. That's all.
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u/MarcusSiridean 4d ago
Good points. The point isn't to reach some cosmic balance, it's to do better today than you did yesterday.
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u/JeVeuxCroire 4d ago
Based on OP's post history, she's 21.
She has plenty of time to do good.
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u/burnalicious111 4d ago
Sure, but I didn't want the assumption that it's not worth it because you can't undo your past to stand.
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u/Specific-Variation66 4d ago
couldn’t agree more, that’s what it means to be human, although me personally even if he has changed i’ll still kinda give him the side eye lol but all jokes aside dude decided he no longer wants to convince himself it was ok to be a scum bag, that’s a hard thing to do, that pride man see that pride will trap you in your ways
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u/marcarcand_world 4d ago
Also, the good place isn't a true story. There's no point system of goodness and evilness. OP won't be tortured by a 800ft tall fire octopus.
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u/standbyyourmantis 4d ago
But while we're on the topic of The Good Place, there's a relevant quote here.
What matters isn't if people are good or bad. What matters is if they're trying to be better today than they were yesterday.
Nobody can undo the past, but everyone has the opportunity to get better. OP has taken the hardest steps of realizing that they were doing bad, now they just have to keep being better.
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u/godofpumpkins 4d ago
That’s what they want you to think. What if The Good Place is the only true story we’ve ever witnessed and is accidentally 99% correct like the story in the show goes 🤯🤯😶🌫️
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u/marcarcand_world 4d ago
Well then it's all pointless anyways because no one has been admitted into the good place since the Renaissance. We're going to be tortured forever anyways
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u/godofpumpkins 4d ago
We’ll break free somehow! The system is clearly quite fallible. Or at least I think it is but I haven’t finished the show yet
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u/marcarcand_world 4d ago
Get ready for F E E L S (and the time knife)
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u/squishypoo91 4d ago
Right? I cried on and off for a few days after finishing it and there were months where I'd tear up even thinking about it lol
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u/marcarcand_world 4d ago
Chidi broke me like the dot in Jeremy Bearimy
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u/squishypoo91 4d ago
The waves speech and then the calendar 😭😭😭😭 UGLY sobbing(mixed with laughter over the calendar)
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u/orangesandmandarines 4d ago
I reqatched it not long ago and even considered not watching the end just to avoid dehydration. But it is so good...
My bf said that he didn't know it was possible to cry THAT MUCH without a real-life tragedy happening in your closest circle.
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u/squishypoo91 4d ago
Hoo boy prepare yourself. That show left me an emotional wreck for about a month lol. A BEAUTIFUL story, but gut wrenching
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u/DK_Adwar 4d ago
I remember seeing something that said something along the lines of "character is what you do when nobody is watching". I feel like it's appropriate here.
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u/Creative-Improvement 4d ago
I like this quote;
“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”
― Marcus Aurelius
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u/drunk_with_internet 4d ago
Exactly. There are no “good” or “bad” people. Just people who do good or bad things. Both co-exist in us all. Our choices are what matter.
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u/subeam 4d ago
But aren't we the culmination of our actions? If I routinely choose to do things that harm other people, wouldn't that make me a bad person? Because I'm choosing the bad options, I'm choosing to live life and be bad.
Whereas a good person is just shorthand for someone who routinely does good/chooses to do things that enrich the lives of other people. They are good because they choose to do good acts, being good.
And, of course, there's our internal selves. The "I". I think we all have a sense of when we do right or wrong, if we're mean or kind, if we're good or bad or gray over all, etc.
I wholeheartedly agree with the second half of Kat-Sith's statement ("But being a better person doesn't come from the approval of others, it comes from uplifting people and fighting against injustice" is an amazing statement!) but I just can't wrap my head around "good and evil are things people do, not who they are." Isn't what we do part of who we are? And while we all have good and bad in us, by our choices we continuously reinforce one side over the other.
Sorry, this is more a philosophical question rather than one with any real interest in the OP post lol. I find the perspective of good and bad being separate from a person intriguing and hard to grasp!
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u/MaxAttax13 4d ago
I interpreted it more like, being a good or bad person isn't a label that immutably defines who you are as a person. Even if you have done bad things in the past, that doesn't mean you're a bad person forever. If you truly regret what you've done and have put forward real effort into changing your actions, you can work towards being a better person than you were.
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u/KnotYoBoi 4d ago
“Good and evil are things that people do, not who they are”
This is personally so fucking liberating. I love you man!
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u/need_mor_beans 4d ago
You are likely the best candidate for a "strong ally" against "that kind of mentality." You went through it and came out the other side thinking differently. You are actually a person that should be interviewed and serve as a blueprint for how "toxic" one side can be and how a person can be "changed" afterwards from having a "wake up" experience. Sleep well tonight knowing you are a person seeking better things and better outcomes - it's an admirable place to be.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
Thank you.
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u/betzevim 4d ago
In all seriousness, if you're looking for ways to do "good" in the world... this guy is correct. You are in a prime position to talk to other people who are where you used to be. You can understand how they think, why they think that way, and what types of things might be able to change their thinking, better than anyone who was raised liberal will ever be able to.
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u/NotThatPJ 4d ago
Came here to say this. OP, you have something of extraordinary value: Perspective. You can speak to what it was like inside that belief system, in words that people still in it might just hear. They won't always, or even often, be receptive to it, but you have a better shot than anyone else.
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u/Creative-Improvement 4d ago
One point here : the big fallacy is that you can change peoples thinking. That’s impossible, like unlearning how to ride a bike, or unlearn reading. What you can do though is backtrack on their belief system (epistemology) and find out how they came or what are the pillars of their belief, so they start questioning it. It involves being intensely curious with one you are talking to.
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u/DeathMetalTransbian 4d ago
The most important question is "Why?" Asking "why?" is what deradicalized me. Asking "why?" is how I got my mother and sister to understand that voting for Trump again is not in their best interest.
Communication, understanding, and contemplative thought can move metaphorical mountains.
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u/breadcreature 4d ago
To add to this, I think it's really important to have people in this position not just because they can often be more appealing to those who need convincing, but also that it is exhausting and often unsafe to have to do it yourself as a minority. There's always that balance to be struck between standing up for yourself and changing minds, and not exposing yourself to more shit and potentially danger. Not least, constantly having to be an ambassador for your demographic is not an enjoyable way to live.
I have known many people who toot their horns about being an ally to me who have done way less (and often been more irritating) than people who never bring it up but push back against bigoted attitudes in their blue collar jobs and situations like that where it can be tolerated a bit more. I would not be able to do that myself, not more than a couple of times at least.
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u/Marseppus
4d ago
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What is better – To be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort?
-Paarthurnax, Skyrim
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u/AlexstraszaMcQueen 4d ago
I came here to check if anyone commented this quote because it’s one of my favorite quotes ever (from one of my favorite games ever). It’s so fitting for this post.
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u/PurpleSwitch 4d ago
This quote legitimately shaped me as a person. When I was younger, I considered myself to be a shitty person, very selfish. It was true to an extent - growing up poor meant I was reluctant to share anything unless I was certain I had more than enough for myself (usually meaning an excess to act as a buffer to make me feel safe), plus being bullied taught me that vulnerability was something to be punished. I don't think I was too bad though, I think most of it was bad self esteem that made me believe I was evil, or close to it.
I didn't like feeling like a bad person, and there was a lot of shame around it - after all, how absurd for a repugnant person to make it about themselves and go all "woe is me". I tried my best to put on a mask of goodness and "pretend" to be decent, but the more people believed I was good, the more guilty I felt for deceiving them.
The Paarthurnax quote really helped me though. I don't see my sense of self as static like I used to, but it gave me a means to get better despite the poisonous self talk within me. I could reframe my "pretending" to be good as overcoming my selfish and shitty nature, through great effort. Instead of deceitful, my outwards efforts were a show of valiant defiance.
I got better at doing good over the years, and I think it clicked for me when I realised I had trained myself to be instinctively kind. A friend of a friend came into hard times and I reflexively said "I can help", even though helping them would be quite a stressful situation for me. I don't think I'd have made it to that point without this quote, which feels so silly, but whatever works, works, right?
I don't know if I believe in an innate nature of any sort, good or bad, but if there is one, I think the fact that I want to be good counts for something
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u/Colamancer 4d ago
Nice to see you taking your job of looking after dragons all the way to reddit Life Binder 👍
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u/shiny_xnaut 4d ago
Sometimes a hypocrite is nothing more than a man in the process of changing.
-Dalinar Kholin, The Stormlight Archive
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u/Renown84 4d ago
The most important step a man can take. It's not the first one, is it? It's the next one. Always the next step, Dalinar.
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u/TUFKAT 4d ago
But, well, yet, I still feel like I can never redeem myself. I can never put more positive out that I did negative.
I want you to focus on this part here.
You have absolutely made mistakes with your past, but that you are putting yourself through so much agony, and punishing yourself from your past actions, speaks volumes of the person you are today.
I want to congratulate you for the strength of character it must have taken to rid yourself of your previous world to move forward.
You have done what you can to attempt to atone for your sins, and that is admirable. I don't sense any blame on others with what you said, you have straight up owned you were.
Focus on who you are today. Be who you are today. But I'm not going to knock someone further down when they're already telling me how much they f'd up.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
Thank you. This means a lot.
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u/Automatic_Name_4381 4d ago
Do you need someone to tell you that you're doing good, to give you permission to stop living in a place of self torture over your past? Not being facetious or snarky. I know for me there's many things where I need an outside perspective from someone I appreciate to tell me it's not necessarily ok, but that I can let myself out of the "I'm a piece of shit" bunker.
Our 3 pound anxiety hamburgers are often very unkind to us :)
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u/BrowningLoPower 4d ago
I would need one. I've always felt that even if you strongly believe something (or want to), you should get a third party to confirm it. Like having someone proofread your essay.
I like to think I'm a good person, but I mess up and it's "empirical evidence" that I'm actually a mediocre person. Sometimes people will tell me I'm a good person, but I don't believe them anyway. It's such a challenge, especially when I have legitimate shortcomings.
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u/sirpsionics 4d ago
I'd like to hear your story. What motivated you to change?
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
I used to binge watch a channel called The Quartering, and they did a hit piece on the game Celeste, because a trans flag was visible in one cutscene in a corner, fifteen pixels wide, for roughly five seconds total.
Honestly just made me realize how absolutely stupid it all was. Things started crumbling from there.
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u/Automatic_Name_4381 4d ago
I never would have guessed something like this would cause the smallest of cracks. But I'm glad it did. I think you owe yourself some credit too; it would have been very easy for you to just overlook how this episode of the quartering made you feel. But you faced that doubt, those feelings.
Not very many people do that.
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u/Puzzled-Essay-5643 4d ago
Honestly, good for you. That is a stupendous amount of courage and growth.
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u/spudsoup 4d ago
That is so interesting, I never would’ve expected the story that a little thing like that would be the pulling of a thread that unraveled it all. It’s poetic and so hopeful. And since our deepest desire/instinct is to belong, what you’ve done in turning away from your community’s beliefs is the bravest and hardest thing. Thanks for sharing.
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u/ispariz 4d ago
As a trans person it makes me really happy to hear that the right’s weird obsession with us is what made you stop and think. I hope you’re not the only one like that.
Thing is, trans people make good scapegoats. We’re like 1% of the population, often “invisible”, so many people don’t know any irl examples of trans people in their daily lives. We also play on their fears of being medicalized and having surgeries and medications, and if course trans adults were once trans kids.
I think the right has won the abortion fight, realized that the race thing doesn’t have good optics since in plenty of places in the US, white people are a statistical minority or very close, further restricting immigration would tank the economy, so they’re looking for other groups to focus on.
Anyhow, I think people like you can reveal a LOT of insight into the thought processes that get and keep people in bigotry, and that’s so important. You have a lot to offer.
Also, i wanted to mention, my mom was gay, I’m bi, trans, disabled, and half latino, and I didn’t escape my teenage years in the 00s and 10s without holding some terrible views. We live in a society that tries to indoctrinate people into that shit, and NO ONE is totally immune.
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u/Tnigs_3000 4d ago
It’s crazy how something so small can have such a profound effect. I’m sure it took a lot of courage to admit that the life you were living wasn’t the life you actually wanted to live. People have a very hard time accepting that they were wrong, but not you.
You’re miles ahead right now man. As long as you focus on love and compassion you’ll grow even higher than where you are now. I’m sure it felt really good letting that level of hate go away.
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u/ReaperOfFates A wild answer appears! 4d ago
I love hearing that Celeste was part of this experience.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
Oh, yeah. The funny bit was, celeste infuriated me. "A man, can't just.. Become, a woman!" All that shit. I didn't realize at the time, but my "disgust" was actually jealousy.
Now, if only I wasn't in americas butthole, then maybe I could start hrt.
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u/SIGPrime 4d ago
Wow that is crazy to me. I’m MTF and recently left the south after making the self discovery. If you are looking to explore gender, I would personally say first thank you for having the strength of character to change and second it’s much better in New England than it was in Texas. My life has improved so much. It was hard to leave for many reasons but I was going to wither into nothing there. Best decision I’ve ever made really.
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u/Wise_Temperature9142 4d ago
I love this answer because it shows once again how much representation matters. Representation of minorities in any popular media matters, and it should matter to everyone, not just minority audiences.
To all the people who complain they have to see a queer symbol or a black actor, and how forced it might feel, think of this individual’s story next time.
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u/hellshot8 4d ago
Of course you can.
Get therapy, also
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u/curiouscat86 4d ago
I want to clarify; this isn't "get therapy" as in you're effed up and need treatment before you should be allowed in polite society
but rather "get therapy" as in you don't have to go on this incredibly difficult journey alone; it's okay to ask for and receive help.
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u/astrid_s95 4d ago
In addition to therapy, OP, you might do some reading on moral injury.
Here's some to start:
https://moralinjuryproject.syr.edu/about-moral-injury/
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpsy/article/PIIS2215-0366(21)00113-9/fulltext
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u/ButtercuntSquash 4d ago
I wanted to say thank-you for sharing these links, this is the first time I have come across the term Moral Injury and I feel like it will help in my own personal journey, so yeah good share 👍🏻
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u/OKMushroomMaker 4d ago
To add, therapy is you talking to a person who has tools to help you work through the problems. Maybe you don't want to forgive yourself. That's fine. Acceptance is fine. You're at that stage. Accepting that you were not a good person, while never forgiving yourself for being a bad person isn't healthy, but it IS fine. Maybe after years of contemplation, you can forgive yourself.
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u/Azdak66 4d ago
Not only can you be a “good” person, you have already become one.
I don’t have much patience with “feel good” aphorisms, but I do believe that “you can’t change what you did yesterday, you can only change what you’ll do tomorrow”. We all have actions, thoughts, etc, that we did in our pasts that we are not proud of. And it’s ok to sometimes feel bad about that. But if you’re on a better path now, that’s what is most important.
Look at West Virginia Senator Robert Byrd. He grew up in a racist background, was active in the Klan, and was an ardent segregationalist. Somehow, he turned his life around and spent his remaining years in the Senate as a champion for civil rights. Today, that’s what most people remember about him, not his more unsavory past.
Congratulations on your personal growth. Keep looking forward.
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u/Foreign-Nobody3476 4d ago
You're already on the way. I can't imagine what's growing up with people like your father and grand father was like.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
My sister had a black boyfriend, and admittedly, the guy wasn't great. Pretty shitty guy.
That doesn't excuse my grandfather going for the gun when he saw him.
Trust me, it's difficult. It still is.
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u/jessie_monster 4d ago
It sounds like you are working through generations of hatred. I wish you luck on your journey.
I'm not sure you're interested, but the actor Danny Trejo has a book out about his life. He was an addict and a career criminal that managed to turn his life in a different direction.
The part that stuck with me was "everything good that has happened to me is because I did something good for someone else"
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u/Anxious_Sapiens 4d ago edited 4d ago
Hey. One of the coolest dudes I ever met was a reformed skinhead. He even showed me the giant swastika he had tattooed on his back. He told me not a day goes by that he doesn't regret being a shitty person in the past.
I can tell he was genuine. I mean, I'm a mixed dude married to a black dude. In his former life I would have for sure been a target to this guy. But he was always respectful to me and my husband. He went above and beyond to show that he had changed, and because of that, I do believe you can redeem yourself.
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u/hulksmash1234 4d ago
Just out of curiosity, why didn’t he have the tattoo removed?
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u/bacon1292 4d ago
Tattoo removal is a difficult, lengthy, expensive, and painful process. He might not be in a place in his life where he's ready to go through all that, and figures keeping his shirt on in public is good enough for now.
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u/Wise_Temperature9142 4d ago
It’s expensive, takes a long time, and sometimes not completely feasible. I’ve seen tattoo artists that donate free coverups for reformed people with tattoos that showed symbols of hate. I wish removals would do the same.
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u/V_es 4d ago
First of all it’s expensive as hell. It also takes many visits for long duration of time. Pigment is broken down and you need time for white blood cells to remove it, but it doesn’t happen in one go so you come back. A friend of mine had one removed and it took about 5 months and around $3k, and it was in a size of a smartphone. If it’s a full back tattoo it would cost something like $10k and will take a year.
That’s why people cover up hate tattoos with other tattoos.
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u/Anxious_Sapiens 4d ago
Unfortunately I never asked. It was a huge tattoo, it's possible he figured it would be too expensive or painful to remove.
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u/Ignonym 4d ago
That man is gone. Who are you?
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
I don't know, actually. I live so much in the shadow of my past that I'm unsure of who I am now.
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u/CK1277 4d ago
Look up the story of Ann Atwater, a black civil rights activist, and how she became friends with C.P. Ellis, a leader of the local KKK. They went on to work together as public speakers and the fact that Ellis was formerly a member of the KKK actually gave him a greater platform to do good.
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u/3hippos 4d ago
There is also a book called Rising Out of Hatred, which is the story of the white suprematist who learned and grew into new beliefs and values. It’s a great book.
I have a lot of time for people who learn and grow and growing out of these types of beliefs is harder than a lot of personal growth.
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u/quesoCapita 4d ago
You are in a unique position to really make an impact. People who need to hear why and how you changed might listen to you.
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u/baldforthewin 4d ago
Volunteer.
Esp with communities you feel you may have harmed.
The fact that you've changed and challenged your views is already the biggest hurdle.
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u/floweryspacepunk 4d ago
Yeah, I came here to say this. OP, Find the communities you hurt around you and find out how you can help without centering yourself. Just help. Right now there’s a shit ton of anti-LGBTQ+ plus laws being pushed. There are also a lot of community organizations fighting them. That may be a good place to start. Or find if there is a local Food Not Bombs around you or some other group doing similar work. It’s a good place to get connected to your community and help a lot of people.
The big thing is to make sure you’re not putting yourself at the center of attention. Just be there to help. It’s not about redemption as much as it is about helping communities you’ve hurt in the past. At the end of the day, just try to be a kind person and fight for the vulnerable people around you from here on out. That’s all we can do.
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u/Nezeltha 4d ago
Being a good person is a decision, not an outcome.
But salvation, redemption, they imply judgment of some kind. There is no parole board determining if you get to leave the prison of being called a skinhead. You can't hope for people's approval as proof you're a good person.
That being said, the disapproval of some people can be a decent measure of whether you're moving in the right direction. Actually, the person you described your former self as is exactly one of those people. Think of the version of yourself that you most want to distance yourself from. What would he think of you? If he'd hate, pity, or otherwise disapprove of you, you're probably going in the right direction.
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u/daisychain444 4d ago
You're not a fuck up OP
I mean once u saw how much hurt u were doing u made the moves to change and rectify it. That's huge. It takes massive humility to do that. Your entire world view is different now. Of course you're gonna have problems adjusting to a new world.
You're not a bad person OP. Just keep trying. Maybe try to get others to see how much hate they're sending out into the world and help rehabilitate them if the work you're doing now isn't enough. Safe ppl like urself and maybe you'll find your redemption there
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u/Leodogg 4d ago
People can change. I used to be a piece of shit. Glass house, white Ferrari, live for New Year's Eve, sloppy steaks at Truffoni's. Big, rare cut of meat with water dumped all over it, water splashing around the table? Makes the night *so* much more fun. After the club, go to Truffoni's for sloppy steaks. They'd say, 'No sloppy steaks,' but they can't stop you from ordering a steak and a glass of water! Before you knew it, we were dumping that water on those steaks. The waiters were coming to try and snatch 'em up; we had to eat as fast as we could. Oh, I miss those nights; I *was* a piece of shit though!
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u/Illustrious-Hippo-38 4d ago
I used to be a piece of shit. Spiked up blonde hair, little bitty jeans, chicken spahgetti at chickallinis. People can change.
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u/Green_Diet_4271 4d ago
One of my favorite sayings is always been as long as you're still breathing there's always hope right at least you're certainly hope so
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u/whiskersMeowFace 4d ago
I think the fact that you are worried about this, acknowledge your past, and want to be better speaks volumes on your behalf.
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u/Even-Bedroom-9482 4d ago
The answer is yes, you can be redeemed, but you are the one doing the forgiving. There is no outside influence that will show mercy on you. You will need to find the path that allows you to show mercy on yourself.
You will do your best work in the world and live in the best way once you understand, and act on, ending the self-blame. By forgiving yourself and moving forward, you are in fact helping those who you used to hate.
The answer is already answered. Yes, you are a good person. The real question is, how will you teach yourself to see it?
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u/Moisture-Eyes 4d ago
good isn't something you are, its something you do.
Do what feels right to you, and one day I hope you can forgive yourself.
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u/funkyfun2 4d ago
Yes, the people worth being around will look at who you are now and not who you were. Those that don't, and there will be some, are just people being some version of the old you, so know they to can redeem themselves but until then don't fret their bs or let it affect you. Just keep moving on. Your doing great. Welcome, we're all glad your here.
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u/mightyjoe227 4d ago
Yes. Get up, get out. Do what you honestly believe is right.
Also, what is right for you. You also have to understand that leaving might or will have to be done
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u/YoungLorne 4d ago
You already are a good person - to everyone except yourself. Therapy could help, but basically recognize that your surroundings made you what you were. Be proud that you escaped.
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u/disgruntledgrumpkin 4d ago
All you can do is try to be better than you were, you know? All of us have done things we aren't proud of. Redemption isn't a far off goal, it's a choice you've already been making every day. I'm proud of you.
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u/Even-Bedroom-9482 4d ago
By the way there is a group called Life After Hate and they’ve been there too
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u/Yochanan5781 4d ago
I am Jewish and queer, probably someone your former self would have despised, and I am telling you that redemption is possible. There have been a handful of prominent former skinheads who turned their lives around and dedicated themselves to repairing the world from the ideologies they were a part of, Christian Picciolini is one. I would say that the fact you're having anxiety about this is a good sign, just keep doing the work to make repentance, because it is a lot of work, but fulfilling.
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u/fr0_like 4d ago
All persons, I feel, have a shot at redemption. I’m not religious, I’m philosophical. We’re human, we make mistakes. We can learn from past mistakes. I feel we need to look at ourselves to understand what to offer others. I know I’m not perfect. I know I’ve worked hard to change, and have. I know I’m a better person than I used to be. I know this is possible because i have lived experience to prove that fact. I’ve seen it in others. I can offer you understanding, compassion, and a faith in finding your own redemption. I think people have it in their power to do that for each other. It makes the world a better place to give people a chance to do better.
What I can also say is, when we hurt people, that pain remains. Forgiveness can alleviate it a little, but the pain endures. It may fade with time and be largely forgotten, but if you go dig it up, that pain still hurts, fresh and raw as the first day. And we have to live with knowing we caused that for someone; or that we experienced it from someone. That’s part of being a human.
We can regret. It doesn’t feel good, but it’s human. And we can go forward in life trying to lead a life that no longer incurs regret.
Point is, I’m half Polish and Nazis killed my family en masse. I’m glad you left behind white supremacy, it’s not a healthy belief system. I’m glad you are making space in life to see the wealth of greatness that abounds in ordinary persons across the spectrum of ethnicity. People can be pretty amazing.
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u/ZengaStromboli 4d ago
Thank you. Thank you, so very much. I am humbled.
I'm very sorry for your loss. It must be quite difficult.
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u/fr0_like 4d ago
It’s fine, I wasn’t alive yet. My grandpa was the only one that survived. We’ll both, you and I, do our best to make the world a better place by being the best kind of person we can be. I think that helps a lot. Best wishes on your journey.
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u/bomberman461 4d ago
“for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus” Romans 3:23-24
I’m not sure what your religious beliefs are, but you specifically asked about salvation which is the primary tenet of the Gospels. Before you reject this entirely, please read the whole chapter of Romans 3, it’s very short but i believe it will give you some hope. And if you want, I have no problem chatting with you about it via PM. God bless you.
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u/Wise-Swimming5046 4d ago
I was talking about this on another thread a second ago.
Deeyah Khan - Meeting the Enemy
Yes, it is possible.
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u/Imperator_Gone_Rogue 4d ago
People like you give me hope. Keep up the good work and take care of yourself.
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u/TheGreatQ-Tip 4d ago
It's impossible to quantify the positive and negative impact of your actions. All you can do is keep trying to be a good person. It's not easy to make the kind of change that you did, especially when you're born into it. Try not to blame yourself too much.
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u/EuropeanSuperLegolas 4d ago
As other comments have said the ability to introspect puts you on an amazing path. Good luck on your journey
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u/amitym 4d ago
Good person?
Beats the fuck of outta me, what is a good person? I don't know what that is or whether you are one.
I do know some things about what kind of person you are though.
You are the kind of person who gets their shit together and turns themself around. You are the kind of person who takes responsibility for what goes into their head and what comes out of their mouth. You are the kind of person who has trouble getting out of bed but does it anyway. You are the kind of person who can say, "I fucked up bad," and is still here to tell the tale.
You are the kind of person who posts frankly about their uphill struggle on reddit. Who donates, contributes, protests.
Nobody anointed you as that kind of person. You made yourself that kind of person.
So what other kind of person do you want to be? The kind of person who helps kids at risk of falling into despair or hate? The kind of person who raises kids of their own, better than you were raised? The kind of person who teaches? Leads in public life? Fights for the rights of others in a courtroom? Creates a safe haven for others?
The kind of person who has the strength to shoulder responsibility for the adversity they face every day, and seeks help from a professional mental health counselor?
You are tough as fuck to have made it to where you are. I don't believe there's anything you can't do. And whatever you choose, that will be the kind of person you are. Which is all you need to be.
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u/TTheorem 4d ago
Yes. Straight up.
And I’m one of those leftists that really does not like fash.
Your actions going forward are what really count.
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u/Sparky81 4d ago •
Yes. I don't know what more to say than that. You're already on a good path. You can't always erase the past, all you can do is be better now.